Why can't we define $\liminf$ as $\liminf_nA_n=\bigcap_{n\in\Bbb N}\bigcap_{k\ge n}A_k.$

53 Views Asked by At

I know that $\liminf$ is defined as

$\liminf_nA_n=\bigcup_{n\in\Bbb N}\bigcap_{k\ge n}A_k.$

I understand that it means that it is a member of all but finitely many of $A_n$.

My question is why don't we then define it as

$\liminf_nA_n=\bigcap_{n\in\Bbb N}\bigcap_{k\ge n}A_k.$

Are the two definitions the same? I am unable to spot the difference. Please help.

3

There are 3 best solutions below

2
On BEST ANSWER

Let $$ B_n = \bigcap_{k \ge n} A_k. $$ Then $B_1$ consists of every element that belongs to all of $A_1,A_2,\dots$. $B_2$ consists of every element that belongs to all of $A_1,A_2,\dots$ except possibly not to $A_1$. $B_3$ consists of everything that belongs to $A_1, A_2, \dots$ except possibly not to $A_1$ or $A_2$. Therefore

$$\bigcup_n B_n = \liminf A_n $$

consists of everything that belongs to all of $A_1,A_2,\dots$ except possibly not to finitely many of them. The key phrase is "all but finitely many."

On the other hand,

$$ \bigcap_n B_n = \bigcap_n A_n $$

is the set of everything that belongs to all of $A_1,A_2,\dots$.

For example, let $A_1 = \{1\}$ and $A_2 = A_3 = A_4 = \dots = \{1, 2\}$. Then $B_1 = \{1\}$ and $B_2 = B_3 = B_4 = \dots = \{1,2\}$. So

$$ \bigcap_n B_n = \bigcap_n A_n = \{1\} $$

because only $1$ belongs to all of $A_1,A_2,\dots$. But

$$ \bigcup_n B_n = \{1,2\} $$

because $1$ belongs to all of $A_1,A_2,\dots$ and $2$ belongs to all but finitely many of $A_1,A_2,\dots$ (all but $A_1$).

5
On

Take $A_n = \{-n,-(n-1),-(n-2),...\}$. Then the first definition gives the integers, but the second definition gives the natural numbers. So they are different.

0
On

Suppose $A_0=\varnothing$. Then $\bigcap_{n\in\Bbb N}\bigcap_{k\ge n}A_k=\varnothing$, regardless of the values of the other $A_n$! That's bad. This extreme sensitivity to the first set in the sequence is the opposite of what we want from a limit operator.

A good limit definition should not depend at all on $A_0$. (For that matter, it should not depend on $A_1$, and it should not depend on $A_2$...)